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GetFreedomware.com development has started

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ariadacapo's picture
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Hello everyone,

We have begun working on GetFreedomware.com, the successor of SoftwareLiberty.com. You are encouraged to participate.

some context
Landy DeField has joined the GLM Advisory board recently; he has been advocating the use of the term "freedomware" to designate free software for a long time. He donated the domain getfreedomware.com to GLM and we are going so start using that term on all our websites.
SoftwareLiberty is a nice little project, but it has had only limited success so far (about 40 visits per day, PR4). I think this is because it is a nice "intellectual" concept, but fails to be immediately relevant to the average user.

case use

Developer Alice has a free software project. She calls it open-source because "free software" is ambiguous and raises many questions from would-be users. Pointing them to long philosophical texts is neither effective nor relevant for her.

She only wants a quick, effective way for user Bob to understand why her software is better than proprietary freeware.

She labels her software "freedomware", optionally with a logo button, and makes a link to getfreedomware.com .

Bob is about to decide which program he is going to use for a specific purpose (say, edit pitcures). He finds Alice's project which says it's freedomware. From there, he visits getfreedomware.com, and in a 45-second read, has grasped enough to now prefer freedomware over freeware.

what we're looking for

I have already made a draft of the website, derived from the current SL site. You can download the built website from the wiki page on our tracker (direct link)

The text content is almost finished. It needs corrections, improvements. The 2 critical requirements are
1. to be extremely short. The target is 250 words
2. to be easy to read and comprehend
This primes over precision and exactitude.

The style needs to be changed. We are looking for a less "elegant intellectual", more sexy, attractive, young design - but again simplicity is critical here.

Finally, we are looking for a logo for freedomware.

how to contribute

The fastest way is of course to contribute in this forum, but you can be much more effective by making a checkout of our SVN repository at
https://svn.gnulinuxmatters.org:81/getfreedomware/trunk/

You can edit files locally; to commit to that repository, request commit rights by contacting us.

To build the actual site from these repository files, you need to have created an account on our website management system (run by Poliglota, the masterpiece of Gustavo), and then request editing rights by contacting us again.

intended roadmap

Once we are satisfied with the text contents, we will open up translation of that, exactly the same way that GetGNULinux.org is now translated.

We'd love to have this site, as well as a couple of translations, on-line by July. We will then change all the references to "free software" into "freedomware" on GetGNULinux.org, and announce everything with a press release in 3 languages.

That's it! I'd love to see anyone participate,

Olivier.

Gustavo's picture
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[off topic] I think the

[off topic]
I think the right domain is getfreedomware.org
[/off topic]

Bjwebb's picture
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This is a really great

This is a really great idea. I have started using the term freedomware myself. Like you say, the style does need to be changed to fit the new purpose, but the text is good. I especially like the fact that it helps argue the fact that we're not all just tight with money (I am, but thats beside the piont Smiling) One thing though, the footnote could do with explaining why we are not using the term free software.

Quote:

In practice the requirements are identical, although because the term "open" doesn't call to mind freedom, it may miss the point.

could be changed to

Quote:

In practice the requirements are identical. However, me prefer the name Freedomware becasue freedom is the most important thing. The term "open" misses the point and Free Software (although designed to refer to freedom) is often confused with freeware

Gustavo's picture
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I've seen the draft and I

I've seen the draft and I really like it.

Some remarks:

  • I think it would be great if the text in the header could be more eye-catching (slightly different colors, bigger fonts, and a different background or perhaps wrapped around a box... for example).
  • Also, I'd rephrase that text as: "There's more to software than price. Freedomware is good for you, your business and society".
  • There are two points that are basically the same thing (source code): "Now you can trust your computer" and "It works through source code", so I think we should merge them. What about
    Quote:

    You can now trust your computer. Technicians may inspect the "recipe" of any freedomware to check that it really works as expected and doesn't violate the users' privacy under the hood. On the contrary, the real behavior of a lot of common software, like Acrobat Reader or Windows, is only known by their makers. Doesn't the "He who owes nothing fears nothing" saying tell you something?

  • We call it "Freedomware", but don't explain why it's a matter of freedom (I think "freedom and authority over what is happening inside it" is not a good explanation on why it's a matter of freedom). In SoftwareLiberty.com we have a better explanation, I think.
  • I'm not fond of the "non-free" and "proprietary" adjectives for that kind of software. May I suggest "freedom-trampling software" instead? Altough it's perhaps too offensive for the context (who has a better alternative?).
  • I'd rephrase the second paragraph of "You can copy freedomware" as:
    Quote:

    Freedomware is like mathematics: You can use it for any purpose, including commercial, as long as you don't impose restrictions on the things someone else made - very sensible, isn't it?

  • I'd rephrase "Freedomware is easy to use" as
    Quote:

    Freedomware is easy to use and often technically superior to freedom-trampling software, since it's supported by many more individuals and organizations. Some famous examples, often just called "open-source" , include the Firefox browser and the Linux operating system.

  • We should add a conclusion paragraph, something like:
    Quote:

    Because now societies and individuals rely on software, it's an essential item like education or electricity and therefore it must be transparent and its access universal - requirements that can only be met with Freedomware.

PS: Here's a typo: "Freedomware, also called open-source or free software, gives you freedom and and authority over what is happening inside it."

a thing's picture
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not completely like math
Gustavo wrote:

I'm not fond of the "non-free" and "proprietary" adjectives for that kind of software. May I suggest "freedom-trampling software" instead? Altough it's perhaps too offensive for the context (who has a better alternative?).

QFT.

Gustavo wrote:

I'd rephrase the second paragraph of "You can copy freedomware" as:

Freedomware is like mathematics: You can use it for any purpose, including commercial, as long as you don't impose restrictions on the things someone else made—very sensible, isn't it?

Who imposes restrictions on math? How?

I suggest addressing copyleft in a separate sentence.

By the way, "freedomware" should not be capitalized.

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gustavo wrote: I'm not
gustavo wrote:

I'm not fond of the "non-free" and "proprietary" adjectives for that kind of software. May I suggest "freedom-trampling software" instead? Altough it's perhaps too offensive for the context (who has a better alternative?).

"Slaveware" comes to mind, a direct opposite to Freedomware. Eye But of course, that's too extreme, but perhaps there is a way to use a milder version of the opposite to Freedomware, like maybe "restrictionware", but that doesn't sound so good.

Ideas welcome, but maybe we can try avoiding talk about freedom trampling software altogether and focus only on defining what freedomware is. This may also be known as the pro instead of the anti strategy, positive rather than negative advocacy. We point to what we believe is good and point out that this is the only thing we believe is good and just ignore everything else.

GetFreedomware wrote:

Freedomware, also called "open-source" or free software1, gives you freedom and and authority over what is happening inside it.

Something about "freedom over what is happening" doesn't sound right to me. It seems it could make more sense as "control over what's happening". Freedom is more about being allowed to do anything you as an individual can do that doesn't hurt someone else. One of those things may be to edit the source code, but that's just an act through which we exercise control over something that rightfully belongs to us (by running on our own computer).. so in this context control comes out of freedom.

About the design, it currently looks like a page of the book, which is nice, but probably not fitting the context so well.. As mentioned, it should be "cool" and exciting.. But anyway, I think it's ok to take this gradually, since we don't even have an approved Freedomware logo and since the logo discussion has stalled. At a point at which we will have a logo we can adapt the design of the site to fit it.

Picking a logo is not something I think we should do alone. We should start with a few definite proposals picked from the submissions we could get if we ask for it through news sites (something that was planned in that thread) and then do another round of feedback to check acceptance. Only then can we adopt it as official. This is because "freedomware" is supposed to be joint marketing effort on behalf of the entire, or the large chunk, of the FOSS communities. It's not just a site.

I will be more focused on Nuxified.org and therefore freedomware related issues once the new Libervis (2008) is released, which is going to be by the end of the next week.

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Some answers.

Hello All,

GetFreedomware.org is also going to be transfered to GLM.o along with the .com. Which one is out front makes no difference to me personally. However the .org will help to boost the relevance in context of the search engine ranking. As it correctly communicates that it is a non-profit.

I am going to take some time and pour over the document made available in the wiki. We will also be contributing ideas towards the logo, site layout color palette and organization identity in general.

FYI: The Tux Project will be coming back on line as FreedomwareMarketing.org/.com TTP.com will become a redirect for old articles and existing links. Our philosophical ideals have changed and we feel this will allow for the inclusion of the greater community and therefore make room for more creative ideas to market freedomware. We will also be taking a much more grass-e-roots approach to marketing freedomware in an effort to inspire and encourage local movements rather than spending all of our time and resources on large one time events.

Maybe some will scoff at this next statement but before you do think about how freedomware has effected your life in terms of less stress more time for your self and family and less time dealing with viruses crapware/slaveware etc... Freedomware causes a philosophical shift in anyone who uses a computer more than 2 hours a day. It serves to vastly improve their productivity and provide much needed traction to be able to move forward. If we can get it into the lives of the people who need it most we will not need the massive resources required for publicity stunts and one time events which tend to smack of insincerity and self adulation.

Freedomware provides freedom in conjunction with computers which is a very mind blowing concept. At least to "our clients" it is but one that they are more than ready for and receive well. Both sides of the philosophical naming issue have done well to market to developers and coders. Now it is time to present the Freedom(thatthissoft)Ware development model provides to our friends and neighbors.

It will require patience as we collect the dew into a drop that then becomes a trickle and turns into a stream. That is to say we cannot rush this as it needs to be organic much like the development process that brought it into existence.

Landy

ariadacapo's picture
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correct! My mistake. I

correct! My mistake.

I think we should use getfreedomware.com as a redirection to the .org domain; maybe at a later time we could use the .com as a ".community" portal to relevant sites. It's a faraway remote idea though.

ariadacapo's picture
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Style changes

I have made a bunch of stylistic changes, it looks a little less "intellectual" now (although not really finished and somewhat broken)
https://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/changeset/653

The new build is available on the GetFreedomware wiki page
https://tracker.gnulinuxmatters.org/wiki/GetFreedomware

Now going to work on the text content...

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I like the new header!

I like the new header!

ariadacapo's picture
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in progress

I have worked most of the day on a better version, but without a result that works so far. I'm trying to take most remarks into account and will hopefully reply adequately tomorrow. Thanks for your patience.

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OK. Lots of things here,

OK. Lots of things here, I'll try to address everything, apologies if something didn't go through.
I have made a new text version (changelog here) which you can download from the wiki page.

Some general remarks

I want to aviod building a free software philosophy manual. The mission of the website is to help Alice to get Bob to use her software. Think: "why Gimp is better than Photoshop Elements", in 45 seconds.

The trouble is that we are tryng to get the idea of freedom across, to somebody who won't use it. Bob will never look at source code. He'll never pay a technician to do it. He'll never adapt or redistribute the program. His usage of the freeware is not restricted by the license. And he's not going to make copies of it.
This is our target audience. Our job is make Bob choose freedomware over freeware nevertheless.

I re-thought-out the text and my intention for the content is as follows:

Quote:

Intro. freedomware is better.

1. it's trustworthy

2. copying is good.

3. freedom matters.

4. don't be afraid.

I hope no-one is offended if/that I am disagreeding with many changes; please kick back if you think I'm wrong. The proposals, are within the order of the text:

intro

Gustavo wrote:

Also, I'd rephrase that text as: "There's more to software than price. Freedomware is good for you, your business and society".

I'm not sure about this... do you see Bob as a business owner? Were you thinking about "finances" rather than business?

1. it's trustworthy

Gustavo wrote:

We call it "Freedomware", but don't explain why it's a matter of freedom (I think "freedom and authority over what is happening inside it" is not a good explanation on why it's a matter of freedom). In SoftwareLiberty.com we have a better explanation, I think.

libervisco wrote:

Something about "freedom over what is happening" doesn't sound right to me. It seems it could make more sense as "control over what's happening". Freedom is more about being allowed to do anything you as an individual can do that doesn't hurt someone else. One of those things may be to edit the source code, but that's just an act through which we exercise control over something that rightfully belongs to us (by running on our own computer).. so in this context control comes out of freedom.

Yes, I agree with all of this. It's the trickiest part of the page though!
I moved the part about freedom to point #3, and kept point #1 as just "control". Let me know if it still sounds awkward.

Gustavo wrote:

There are two points that are basically the same thing (source code): "Now you can trust your computer" and "It works through source code", so I think we should merge them.

That's what I did, although not quite as you suggested. Criticisms welcome.

2. copying is good

Gustavo wrote:

I'd rephrase the second paragraph of "You can copy freedomware" as:

Quote:

Freedomware is like mathematics: You can use it for any purpose, including commercial, as long as you don't impose restrictions on the things someone else made - very sensible, isn't it?

a thing wrote:

I suggest addressing copyleft in a separate sentence.

I think trying to explain copyleft is too ambitious for our purpose here. It is not something Bob does absolutely have to know, and not something he will use anyway.
I hope that the current phrasing ("you may use freedomware for any purpose [...]" and "you have liberty to [...] redistribute"), at least, does not suggest that turning freedomware into freeware is allowed.

3. freedom matters.

Gustavo wrote:

We should add a conclusion paragraph, something like:

Quote:

Because now societies and individuals rely on software, it's an essential item like education or electricity and therefore it must be transparent and its access universal - requirements that can only be met with Freedomware.

I was reluctant to add another paragraph, so I tried to address this in this new 3d paragraph. It's the critical bit, so it needs extra care.
I think we need better wording, but the idea is there.

4. don't be afraid

Gustavo wrote:

I'm not fond of the "non-free" and "proprietary" adjectives for that kind of software. May I suggest "freedom-trampling software" instead? Altough it's perhaps too offensive for the context (who has a better alternative?).

I share your thoughts about non-free software but I have to disagree here. "Freedom-trampling" is extremely strong and we'd need much more space and time to justify that term.
I share libervisco's view that in this case it's better to not go too much against the user and focus on how good freedomware is instead.

Gustavo wrote:

I'd rephrase "Freedomware is easy to use" as

Quote:

Freedomware is easy to use and often technically superior to freedom-trampling software, since it's supported by many more individuals and organizations. Some famous examples, often just called "open-source" , include the Firefox browser and the Linux operating system.

Excellent, done!

others:

Bjwebb wrote:

[footer] could be changed to

Quote:

In practice the requirements are identical. However, me prefer the name Freedomware becasue freedom is the most important thing. The term "open" misses the point and Free Software (although designed to refer to freedom) is often confused with freeware

I am afraid that this will only bring more confusion. Is there a way to simplify this? Try to take the point of view of someone who is completely new to the concept.

a thing wrote:

By the way, "freedomware" should not be capitalized.

I definitely agree.

***********

So, I think there's quite a lot of progress. I hope you can all spend a little time re-reading the new version! It works best after a short walk outside, for that "fresh reading" feeling.

I'm especially looking for improvements to the 3d paragraph (freedom) and for a new picture to illustrate it (instead of the current "code" pic).

Cheers!

Olivier.

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A few small things
ariadacapo wrote:
Bjwebb wrote:

[footer] could be changed to

Quote:

In practice the requirements are identical. However, me prefer the name Freedomware becasue freedom is the most important thing. The term "open" misses the point and Free Software (although designed to refer to freedom) is often confused with freeware

I am afraid that this will only bring more confusion. Is there a way to simplify this? Try to take the point of view of someone who is completely new to the concept.

You are right it is more confusing, but the current footer is also confusing and seems "clunky" since it has been modified one that only addressed the alternate tame of open source. How about:

Quote:

What we call "freedomware" here is also often called "libre software", "free software", or "open source software". Of these, "open source" is most discouraged, since the term "open" doesn't call to mind freedom, so misses the point.

Although, it would be nice just to list a all the alternate names and link to a page explaining why freedomware is better than each (rather than just why the name open source is bad). As far as I know, a page like his doesn't exist (there was freedomware.name but this doesn't work now). IMHO it would be worth creating one (getfreedomware.org/naming), since it will also expalin to people who are already part of the free software movement why we prefer the name freedomware, and why they should use it too, in order to make it less confusing for the new users.

Also, a few formatting comments.

Quote:

improve it for you –this makes freedomware safe

There is no space between the dash and the word this.

Also, the text is justified, which suits the book appearance (aren't you thinking about changing that though), but some of the text looks unnatural, for example, large spacing in the first paragrah.

Quote:

Now you can trust your computer. A lot of

However this is not a major issue.

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I just touched on it in my

I just touched on it in my previous post, so I though I'd reiterate; if we are going to use the name freedomware, and think it is the best name (and I think we should and it is), then we should let other people in the free software community know about it.

One thing we should do is have a page explaining why to use the name itself, as I said previously. It would be great if we could get more people to use this term (especially someone big).

Also, I just did a google search for "freedomware" - the top two are a random technology firm and a bathing suit seller respectively. However, the third is refering to freedom software. I think we should contact him, to tell him what we are doing, and ask if he will link to us.

Once the site is launched, we need to try to boost the google results, so our page is what a user sees when she types in freedomware. All but the first three links on the first page are projects of libervis, so hopefully we'll be able to get them to link to the site.

I know some of this stuff is a bit early, but I thought I'd get it down whilst it was at the top of my brain.

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I haven't read the draft

I haven't read the draft yet, so don't expect me discussing it ;-)

just a quick note on "freedom-trampling software": I dislike the term because it missed the point: the software doesn't deprive anyone of any freedom. One can argue that the licenses deprive us of deserved freedom, but that doesn't give us a good name for the software.
Taco uses or used the term "enslaved software" as opposed to "free software" — I quite like this term: the software is bound per license to masters and is condemned to remain in chains forever (nearly).

What about translations ? How will we transfer the "freedomware" term to other tongues ? We could either keep "freedomware" (an anglicism? Not good IMHO), use (example: French) "logiciel libre" as everyone does, or something like "LOGICIEL-LIBERTÉ ou logiciel libre"... (Does the term "logiciel-liberté" work at all ? Every German equivalent I can think of sounds plain stupid....)

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enslaveware

How about "enslavedware"?

ariadacapo's picture
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Greedomware? (back to

Greedomware? ;-)

(back to serious work soon)

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I agree with bjwebb on

I agree with bjwebb on making an additional page explaining naming and then just linking to it in the section below where other terms are mentioned. I don't think it would hurt as the main page would still be short and sweet, but people who want to know a little bit more can go and read about it.

I think this might be just the base anyway, for now.. the page being constructed now is essentially just an intro page, a "splash" of sorts, but beneath it I'm thinking getfreedomware.org will host a whole campaign which will eventually require some more information and therefore more pages.

That said I think the new version is better. Smiling The design is neat, though, but I think the header could be a bit more exciting. Though I'd say it's hard to envision just how should it look like since we don't have an official logo yet, so maybe it's good to keep it simple and neutral for now, the way it is (clean and not overly engaging).

About terms.. I agree with free-zombie, but in a sense even "enslaved software" is a bit off. I mean, I understand that it's forever condemned to remain in chains of the original developer, but software specifically isn't the thing that cares.. can't really be enslaved Sticking out tongue. Humans can, though.

It seems to me that if we're going with the term from "slavery" (as opposite to "freedom"), the best way might be to just avoid adjectives to "ware" and use the neutral word. But this ends up with slaveware.

It does sound simple, but the whole term "slave" is a bit strong.. but that's the case in any of the other variations (enslaved software, enslavedware etc.).

Cheers

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Hm, while we're discussing

Hm, while we're discussing "slave"-ware vs. "freedom"-ware I have to say I have my doubts about to which extent of absoluteness do these terms really apply. I mean, the reason why I like the term "freedomware" is essentially because it conveys what the likes of Richard Stallman and many others from the Free Software movement always wanted to express about it: free as in freedom.

But that only Freedomware is required or mandatory for an individual to be in freedom isn't quite correct. The point is that they are aware that freedom is important and make a choice accordingly, even if the choice were towards less rights over a copy of software. In addition, the point is that within the context of the society that we have freedomware does offer more freedoms (or more convenience for someone who wants to live free of rules by others).

But if someone chose to use proprietary software even with full awareness of the restrictions involved and with the existence of a freedomware equivalent - I can't really call such a person a slave.

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Also it is often impossible

Also it is often impossible to completely avoid non-free software. Two examples here may be Flash and Skype.
Although we surely can live without those lack of them brings certain limitations. If I don't install Skype I cannot talk to some of my friends, as they are totally resistant to suggestions to install Ekiga. Thus, I install Skype.
My wife, and I sometimes too, like to watch stuff on YouTube. I have found that it is a great source for really cool old techno.

Then there's WMV. How would I love to be able to get around that, but Sunshine Live, a really cool radio-channel does it's Internet-stream either in WMV or in RealAudio...
Same goes for MPEG. I want to export my holiday-/baby-/whatever-videos so I can play them on my DVD-player. Since that box doesn't support Theora I have to go either for MPEG2 or XVID, which both are not supported in Fedora as there are patent-issues with MPEG.

As much as possible though I use really free stuff. When I rip music off a CD I store it as Ogg/Vorbis, my portable player supports that and I'm very happy about that (actually it was a factor when I looked for it).

So, as much as I would like to stay away completely from proprietary software and patent-tainted formats, it is not entirely possible yet, except I decide to lose contact with some friends, stop listening to my favourite Internet-radio and don't watch video from my cam on the DVD-player... Let alone making my wife angry because she cannot watch YouTube anymore...

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Livna
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for these kinds of problems

for these kinds of problems I think ubuntu is doing a good job.
For the codecs they have the unofficial Medibuntu, (don't know about streaming though).
and in 8.04 there is another free firefox plugin for swfdec. It plays youtube videos here, I tried gnash and it doesn't.
I like fedora but I recommend ubuntu for keeping in touch with the proprietary world while using freedomware when possible, fedora for example uses 4K stack kernel, which didn't allow me to install ndiswrapper correctly.

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I'm using the livna-repo

I'm using the livna-repo (for a week or two now; before I compiled what I needed) and it's a great help.
Sadly still not everything I'd like to see there is available. Cinelerra would be a great addition to that repository. And XEphem would be something I'd personally love to see there.

But still, the ideological problem still exists, no matter if you take your stuff from the livna-repo or compile it yourself.

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I never really had the need

I never really had the need for any third party repositories in Ubuntu.. multiverse seems to have everything needed. Also note that a lot of the "restricted" stuff actually is marked as such merely because of patents - and those aren't legal in all countries (not that I care). I've held for quite a while now that there is no ideological problem with using those.. only stuff which is clearly under a proprietary copyright license, which puts it into quite meager company usually... A package or two or what? For most people this seems to be limited to something like flash.

I gotta be honest though I seem to be pending a process of re-evaluating my stands on Freedomware in terms of these ideological issues, given the context of my becoming a voluntaryist. Perhaps I would say that ideological problem exists if I believe that four freedoms are absolutely essential and that therefore even consciously choosing to use something that doesn't grant you some of those freedoms is putting yourself in a non-ideal situation, but I'm hard pressed to find it really unethical. What might be closer to unethical are actual developers striving to restrict the users, but they can't do that unless the user agrees.

It's just.. hard to see much wrong in a voluntary relationship.

By far the worst thing is when the developer, and in this case it's usually a big corporation, manipulates the (corrupt) system itself to actually bypass the free market and leave people with no other choice but to use non-free software. Examples are public schools mandating use of a particular OS for educational programs.

As far as I am concerned I am involved in a Freedomware movement to an extent to which it is a market action towards establishing what we believe to be a better culture, one in which everyone has more rather than less freedom and personal power. Ideologically, in terms of ethics and morals - I can't really say much more yet.

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A new preview is available

Thank you all for the continued input.

A new preview is available (it's an on-line version, not just an archive anymore).

Personally I am getting satisfied with the content and consider this as a beta release (I'm replying to individual remarks above). I believe the main thing missing now is a logo.

Please have a look and share your thoughts and remarks... thanks

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free-zombie wrote: just a
free-zombie wrote:

just a quick note on "freedom-trampling software": I dislike the term because it missed the point [...]
Taco uses or used the term "enslaved software" as opposed to "free software" — I quite like this term [...]

I believe both these terms are too strong. We're already doing the tricky task of using a new name for something that's been around for a long while (free software). The goal here is not to start bashing proprietary software (we've already got lots of content about this) but to make freedomware relevant and attractive.
Most Windows, Photoshop etc users are happy and certainly don't feel enslaved. I think it's a lot of effort to try to convince them otherwise, given the high risk of being dismissed as "extremists".

free-zombie wrote:

What about translations ? How will we transfer the "freedomware" term to other tongues ?

In languages where there is no confusion between gratis and libre (inc French, Castilian/Spanish and German I believe), this is not necessary. In other languages we'll have to see on a case-per-case basis.

Thanks!

Olivier.

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Bjwebb wrote: Although, it
Bjwebb wrote:

Although, it would be nice just to list a all the alternate names and link to a page explaining why freedomware is better than each (rather than just why the name open source is bad).

libervisco wrote:

I agree with bjwebb on making an additional page explaining naming and then just linking to it in the section below where other terms are mentioned. I don't think it would hurt as the main page would still be short and sweet, but people who want to know a little bit more can go and read about it.

I think this might be just the base anyway, for now.. the page being constructed now is essentially just an intro page, a "splash" of sorts, but beneath it I'm thinking getfreedomware.org will host a whole campaign which will eventually require some more information and therefore more pages.

I think that if we have to display a whole page just to explain why freedomware is more explicit, it kind of kills the point, doesn't it?
I was going through the text again and again yesterday, and I removed the link to the "why open-source is bad" Stallman article (which was in the footer). I don't think that we'll be able to change people's mind with just a sentence and a link. Most importantly, it's besides the point. This site is intended to fight freeware, not "correct" or alter the way the community works already. If our website does not convince Alice (see first post in this thread) to use the term "freedomware", telling her she's wrong to use "open-source" won't help.

As for more content, like the portal / campaign you mention libervisco... why not, it's a good idea. It needs to be implemented though, and right now (I'm thinking about a release in a few weeks) we're still a little understaffed for this =)

Bjwebb wrote:

Also, a few formatting comments. [...] There is no space between the dash and the word this.

Also, the text is justified, which suits the book appearance (aren't you thinking about changing that though), but some of the text looks unnatural, for example, large spacing in the first paragrah.

Thank you, I got this corrected now.

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Bjwebb wrote: if we are
Bjwebb wrote:

if we are going to use the name freedomware, and think it is the best name (and I think we should and it is), then we should let other people in the free software community know about it.

My idea was to have this website translated in several languages, and then make a big press release (the way we announced the "1 million" project). On top of this I was thinking of a few articles (ex blog posts) explaining why using the term is useful and efficient.
In time, we should have the current link buttons page completely re-worked (it'll be powered by Animador), and it will include link buttons for getfreedomware.org.

Generally I believe the website should speak for itself. If we have to explain it, we are doing it wrong.

Quote:

Also, I just did a google search for "freedomware" - the top two are a random technology firm and a bathing suit seller respectively.

We'll sink them =)

Quote:

Once the site is launched, we need to try to boost the google results, so our page is what a user sees when she types in freedomware. All but the first three links on the first page are projects of libervis, so hopefully we'll be able to get them to link to the site.

That's right, I would not worry too much about libervis competition =) Generally, I don't intend to receive lots of google hits. My hope is for people to discover getfreedomware.org when they hit the homepage of a freedomware project -like getgnulinux.org or gimp.org.

Getfreedomware.org will nicely fit with getgnulinux.org and linuxpreloaded.org . With these three projects behind us we should be able to spend more time spreading the sites, encouraging community growth, etc. Contacting a lot of webmasters out there will be one part of this.

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math again
GFW wrote:

You get to decide.

You may always use freedomware for any purpose, including commercial – you can think of it as "mathematics".

Without the part about copyleft, the italicized part is out of place.

Why is "freedomware" written in an image?

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I use Gnash and it plays

I use Gnash and it plays YouTube videos. But only the Ubuntu Hardy version, the previous versions in Ubuntu didn't work well.

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http://www.nuxified.org/topi