Skip to main content
Welcome guest. | Register | Login | Post

Your chance to ask Sun!

10 replies [Last post]
libervisco's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-05-04

We are doing a cooperative interview on Libervis.com with Simon Phipps who is a "Chief Open Source Officer" at Sun Microsystems.

You are free to propose any questions you'd like him to answer in the thread I just linked.

Questions should generally be in line with topics that I've mentioned in that thread so that we don't wander off too much and the most interesting and relevant questions would be selected for inclusion in the final interview. Of course, if many ask the same basic question in different words, we'd just form that into a single question..

So, there's your chance to ask what you wanted to know about Sun and their relation with Free Software which sure includes OpenSolaris.

Thanks

Offline
Joined: 2005-12-20

Why Doesn't Solaris have a dependency resolving package manager?

would be a goodone.

supermike's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-02-17
Re: Your chance to ask Sun!

Yawn. Oops. I'm sorry. Did you say something about a Sun guy was going to be interviewed? Aren't they the guys that make Java, Solaris, or something like that?

Java
- It's slow.
- The MVC framework is unpopular to some LAMP/LAPP'ers who just want to "get her done". Don't believe me? Look how hard it is to do the MVC technique to print a text field on a Swing form.
- It's fragmented among multiple vendors with incompatibilities. (Microsoft and IBM didn't help Sun in this respect.)
- It's often not backwards compatible.
- Took forever for a version of Java to appear on Linux back in the day -- appeared first on Solaris and then Windows. Linux was an afterthought. The JSP server took even longer than that.
- Swing GUI API is too slow.
- It's hard to compile and run -- things have to be in certain folders and the command line must call these folders and subfolders in the command path in an unusual way.
- Many have moved to Mono, PHP, Python, or VS.NET to get things done. I would reason to bet that most are on PHP and VS.NET. Sun isn't doing *anything* with LAMP/LAPP that I'm aware of.

Solaris
Latest I've heard...
- Doesn't have enough driver support compared to Linux.
- Has a whacky installer still. People get hung up in the install and give up, moving on to Linux.
- Lacks a "yast" like Suse.

JDS
- It's obscure. No one I know even talks about anything except RH, Fedora, Suse, or Ubuntu in the workplace.
- People fear Sun's going to bail on this.

Perhaps Sun can turn my opinion around and I welcome that. Personally, I'm waiting for the company to fold. I don't think it has suitable direction. Practically all its strategies I've seen are 180 degrees from mine and many whom I interact with in the workplace.

But if other guys are liking Java, Solaris, whatever, that's cool. Hope you're making money and/or have job satisfaction.

libervisco's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-05-04

onlinebacon: Thanks, I copied your question to the libervis question proposals thread so we might include it in an interview among other technical questions if Simon agrees to answer those as well (as our topics are mostly non-technical, initially, like CDDL, Java becoming Free Software, future of OpenSolaris etc.).

supermike: I agree. I don't really like Java myself from whatever experience I had with it as a user. I've pretty much avoided it for quite long now and don't even have Java runtime installed anymore.

As for Solaris, you're probably right. Not many people have had very good things to generally say about it, but they did mention certain exceptions like DTrace, zones etc. Another thing is that Sun's Solaris is not all there is to Solaris anymore. Once Sun created the OpenSolaris project as it freed the Solaris code, a few distributions have sprung up, notably the Nexenta OS (AKA GNU/Solaris) for which I've heard people saying pretty good things. It combines the power of GNU with the power of a mature and advanced Solaris kernel.

At least that makes Solaris a bit interesting to us.

That said, no matter our love or hate towards Java and even Solaris, the thing is many people use Java today and many developers create Java programs that are, by the license, Free Software. However, even though they're Free Software they depend on Java which is not Free Software according to the Free Software Definition. Current Java licesne doesn't allow one crucial freedom; ability to distribute derivate copies. And that's one question we'll be asking Simon about although I hear he already promised in the LugRadio show that Java will eventually be freed. Our interview is a chance for him to confirm that and maybe elaborate further.

We can also ask him about your concerns with JDS.

That's what this community interview process is for afterall. It allows you to ask questions you are concerned about and get first hand answers.

Why is Sun interesting to make an interview with? Well, it is one company that has recently gotten very involved with FOSS and has even contributed alot to the FOSS (or at least tried to) and even more importantly, it promises alot to the FOSS community. If it stays true to the path they've been turning to recently, Sun may indeed become one of the most supportive Free Software companies around.

Offline
Joined: 2005-12-20

More, would be, are they thinking about making java open source any time in the future, because with that, would come a speed increase, and also, when they intend solaris to be fully open source if possible (although, then all they would have is hardware)

supermike's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-02-17

I encourage any and all interviews with big vendor reps like this. It beefs up this new forum.

libervisco's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-05-04
"supermike" wrote:

I encourage any and all interviews with big vendor reps like this. It beefs up this new forum.

Actually, it is being done on Libervis.com, not here, but since both Nuxified.org and Libervis.com are part of Libervis Network advertising each other any attention brought to libervis.com can only positively affect Nuxified.org as well. Smiling

Hmm, maybe we could squeeze in a word about Nuxified.org having OpenSolaris forum, in the interview. Cool

Onlinebacon: that is one of the key questions. It will definitely be asked. Smiling

Cheers
Daniel

tbuitenh's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-21

The problem with Java is that it's taught at universities. Laughing

I don't like the Java syntax very much, it's much too complicated. But on the other hand I have to ask: do you know any other general purpose language that can be used in web applets? Javascript is worse because it's completely messed up by differing implementations, and it's slower. Flash is not truly general purpose.
For cross-platform GUI apps, Java is a winner too. Don't tell me you like the looks of the gtk version of WxWidgets.
Finally, Java may not be as fast as c++, but hey, it's a bytecode interpreter (forget the virtual machine marketing blah), what do you expect? I think it's still a lot faster than many other bytecode interpreters.

supermike's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-02-17
"tbuitenh" wrote:

The problem with Java is that it's taught at universities. Laughing

I don't like the Java syntax very much, it's much too complicated. But on the other hand I have to ask: do you know any other general purpose language that can be used in web applets? Javascript is worse because it's completely messed up by differing implementations, and it's slower. Flash is not truly general purpose.
For cross-platform GUI apps, Java is a winner too. Don't tell me you like the looks of the gtk version of WxWidgets.
Finally, Java may not be as fast as c++, but hey, it's a bytecode interpreter (forget the virtual machine marketing blah), what do you expect? I think it's still a lot faster than many other bytecode interpreters.

Flash is what I would use instead of applets. If you use a version that's like 2 versions old, you get a fairly high compatibility among end users.

I have a Java-based cellphone that my management forced upon me. Unfortunately, every time I click something, I have to wait a second before it opens. Typical Java slowness.

The thing that drove me insane with Java was the hard-typing. In order to do something, I had to get the right function. Once I poured over many thousand APIs, or posted my questions on Usenet, I then had to figure out how to call the right APIs in order to convert what data type I had into the data type that was only acceptable to the final function I wanted to use. This process used to drive me insane and was a huge time waster. The OOP purists in the workplace, who really should go take a professor emeritus job at a college or something and get out of my way, seemed to love this and never question authority. This is Linux, however, and it's my job to question authority.

libervisco's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-05-04

As an end user mostly, I don't like flash either. It also requires me to have a proprietary plug in installed and most of what I get are just flash advertisements that only take bandwidth..

What I can handle is AJAX (DHTML, JavaScript..). It requires no extra plugin, practically all modern browsers support it and can still be quite flashy (and functional at the same time) if we really want it to be.

Offline
Joined: 2005-12-20
"tbuitenh" wrote:

The problem with Java is that it's taught at universities. Laughing

I don't like the Java syntax very much, it's much too complicated. But on the other hand I have to ask: do you know any other general purpose language that can be used in web applets? Javascript is worse because it's completely messed up by differing implementations, and it's slower. Flash is not truly general purpose.
For cross-platform GUI apps, Java is a winner too. Don't tell me you like the looks of the gtk version of WxWidgets.
Finally, Java may not be as fast as c++, but hey, it's a bytecode interpreter (forget the virtual machine marketing blah), what do you expect? I think it's still a lot faster than many other bytecode interpreters.

Could perl help you there by any chance?

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.